Men Concepts and Feedback

[TheMostBurning]

Discuss here about your concept to improve this faction,and tell the bugs you found in your experience of playing.Yes,Men would be Gondor

From Terrain Ideas:

Firstly i would improve numenor stonework and fire arrows.NS would cost 3000 and it would double buildings' armor in radius 500(except farms).Fire arrows would cost 2500 ,and they'd double the arrows that buildings fire in radius 500(except farms),in addition all arrows would be fire arrows,meaning that,for example,a level 3 archery range would fire 2 fire arrows(these should hit different targets).
I know,it would cost very much,but it's worth it.I'd increase towers' health too(4500),but they should build 15 second slower.Lastly Soldiers of gondor,spearmen of gondor,tower guards,citadel guards and archers of gondor would receive +50% armor  by purchasing banners(cost increased to 1000) and +50% regeneration rate by purchasing houses of healing while near buildings(except farms).

These changes would slightly steer gondor to a more camp based gameplay.They wouldn't rend gondor a camping faction,but this way its gameplay would fit better with the lore(gondor had only little forces,but the bastions of the second age were the strongest on middle-hearth).It won't affect very much the gameplay until lategame,but proceeding through early to mid game and mid to late game the gondor base will be more and more resistant,not exceeding however,as the balance isn't applied to camping.
I think that for a more balanced modify the building armor bonus should be 60% in radius 500.

[yamsinacan]

Oops, I didn't see this thread. My concept is a different thread, it's called "The Reunited Kingdom."

[yamsinacan]

The Reunited Kingdom
Once Aragorn was crowned King, he eventually reformed the kingdom of Arnor. With this presented, a new concept emerges.

Once Aragorn is crowned King, a special upgrade will be added to the Fortress. It should be a fairly high price, anywhere from 5,000-15,000. Its name should be called "Reestablish Arnor." Once you purchase the upgrade, new soldiers shall be made available. For the Barracks: "Arnor Soldiers" and Arnor Royal Guards and "Arnor Captain"," for the Archery Range: "Arnor Archers" and "Arnor Rangers," for the Stables: "Arnor Knights."

These units will be significantly stronger than their Gondor counterparts. Either in armor, attack damage, or both. Due to their strength, they shall also have a limit. Their limit(for each type of new soldier), should be 4. They do need upgrades purchased for them except banner carriers, but they will require Forge Blades and Heavy Armor to be purchased.

These are simply elite units, not "mini-hero" hordes. They should have higher health, and more vision, as the blood of Numenor ran strong in the Northern Kingdom. The Knight Battalions should have 10 units. The Ranger Battalions should also have 10 units. The Soldier and Archer battalions should have either 10 units (2 rows of 5) 12 units (2 rows of 6) or 15 units (3 rows of 5).

This should not be hard to implement, as only 1 of the 6 units (Arnor Captain) should require a new skin, all the others should have the standard Arnor skins (yours). I find it fits perfect with the crowning of Aragorn, as he eventually did recreate the Kingdom of Arnor.

I would strongly disagree with this being put into the "inn system," as the Kingdoms would be far to close, with the same king, to be using the inn system.

This is what I said in that other topic pretty much.

[TheMostBurning]

I like the idea,really.But i think that the team just doesn't want to work on arnor anymore

After aragorn is crowned king,all unit production buildings can be upgraded with Arnor upgrade(cost 500).Every building must be upgraded to recruit them,this works like normal building level upgrades.

I thought a way to unite the concepts,too.After aragorn is crowned king,all the modifies to fort upgrades and buildings are applied.However,you have to purchase upgrades even though you did before.As men stonework will cost 2000,while numenor stonework 3000,fire arrows cost 1500,while numenor arrows 2500 ecc..
I think,anyway,that aragorn(3500) should be only recruited from the white tower after you captured a inn.From the inn you can recruit Strider for 2000.
I think that aragorn is simply too hard to obtain,he is the strongest hero of the faction,he should be recruitable even though you don't have any inn.There are maps where there are no inns,or where there is only one.Capturing that single inn makes you gain the upper hand with one click,this is simply imba.

The last concept is about trebuchets.They should,first of all,be bigger.In the films they were huge,in-game they are ridicolously smart.
Since bfme1 trebuchets could be upgraded with fire stones.But gondorians never used flaming projectiles,they used rocks and,in case,pieces of numenor bastions.
The flaming stone upgrade should be replaced by numenor rocks upgrade(this is the default upgrade,not related to arnor ).The siege damage is doubled,while there's no longer any fire damage.

[Dralo]

I think,anyway,that aragorn(3500) should be only recruited from the white tower after you captured a inn.From the inn you can recruit Strider for 2000.
I think that aragorn is simply too hard to obtain,he is the strongest hero of the faction,he should be recruitable even though you don't have any inn.There are maps where there are no inns,or where there is only one. Capturing that single inn makes you gain the upper hand with one click,this is simply imba.

actually i agree with you that aragon should be recruited in a gondorian building (the white tower or the barracks) but otherwise in the book strider used to be in an inn, so it is correct, if he may be found there in the game....
but i like your idea of having aragorn, the second version, in the white tower later
maybe it would be better if aragorn is recruitable after one has already obtained this level on (on?) strider...

about your concept of trebuchets:
these trebuchets you are talking about were attached to the walls and towers of minas tirith, so they had to be much bigger than a mobile version
but i think you are right with the flaming projectiles, it would be better to replace them with nomenor rocks (or something similar)

[Jarl Hittheshit]

you already can recruit Aragorn once you have recruit him in the inn. Afer his death you can recruit him in the white tower...
And i think the idea with the reinforcement of Arnor is nice, but there are too many Arnor soldiers to brings them in the old Gondor Barracks. perhaps there should be a new Building after you purchased the Upgrade in the fortress with some chosen usefull Upgrades oder Soldiers.

But i agree with your trebuchets.

[Dralo]

you already can recruit Aragorn once you have recruit him in the inn. Afer his death you can recruit him in the white tower...

oops sorry, didn't know this (i don't play gondor very often)
in this case it should last as it already is...

[TheMostBurning]

Sorry,i made a mistake.I meant that strider would be recruitable from the inn for 2000,while aragorn for 3500(from the white tower)even though you nevere recruited strider before.This is to avoid the lack of a inn becoming a decisive factor,as aragorn is by far the strongest men hero(elessar).

[Lord of Arnor]

The Reunited Kingdom
Once Aragorn was crowned King, he eventually reformed the kingdom of Arnor. With this presented, a new concept emerges.

Once Aragorn is crowned King, a special upgrade will be added to the Fortress. It should be a fairly high price, anywhere from 5,000-15,000. Its name should be called "Reestablish Arnor." Once you purchase the upgrade, new soldiers shall be made available. For the Barracks: "Arnor Soldiers" and Arnor Royal Guards and "Arnor Captain"," for the Archery Range: "Arnor Archers" and "Arnor Rangers," for the Stables: "Arnor Knights."

These units will be significantly stronger than their Gondor counterparts. Either in armor, attack damage, or both. Due to their strength, they shall also have a limit. Their limit(for each type of new soldier), should be 4. They do need upgrades purchased for them except banner carriers, but they will require Forge Blades and Heavy Armor to be purchased.

These are simply elite units, not "mini-hero" hordes. They should have higher health, and more vision, as the blood of Numenor ran strong in the Northern Kingdom. The Knight Battalions should have 10 units. The Ranger Battalions should also have 10 units. The Soldier and Archer battalions should have either 10 units (2 rows of 5) 12 units (2 rows of 6) or 15 units (3 rows of 5).

This should not be hard to implement, as only 1 of the 6 units (Arnor Captain) should require a new skin, all the others should have the standard Arnor skins (yours). I find it fits perfect with the crowning of Aragorn, as he eventually did recreate the Kingdom of Arnor.

I would strongly disagree with this being put into the "inn system," as the Kingdoms would be far to close, with the same king, to be using the inn system.

This is what I said in that other topic pretty much.

Though I am a huge fan of Arnor (just look at my Username ), I don't really like this idea. Arnor ist Arnor and Gondor is Gondor; it's not necessary to mix up the different feelings of these peoples, even though they are very similiar due to the numenorean roots of both countries. Also,Gondor just doesn't need more units, especially not more powerfull ones. I think it's good as it is right now, with Arnor instead of Gondor on several maps.

I like the idea of getting Aragorn easier; I like him, but he is difficult to recruit right now.

Trebuchets are a very old (and good) idea, but it's not easy to mod them because you needed many new animations, as far as I now. But I would like them, too.

MfG

Lord of Arnor

[Shagrat]

I think, that Arnor-stuff would go to much into the 4 Age and Edain plays nearly only (except Angmar) in the 50 years between the Hobbit and LotR and the War of the Ring, the "recolonization" of Arnor began in the 4 Age, the 3 Age endet (if i remember right) with the cleaning of the shire

 

The flaming stone upgrade should be replaced by numenor rocks upgrade(this is the default upgrade,not related to arnor ).The siege damage is doubled,while there's no longer any fire damage.

im against that, because: why should this stone make more damage than the normal projectile? And the flaming Stones are good against Lorien, espescially with Loriens Fortress-up

[TheMostBurning]

I think, that Arnor-stuff would go to much into the 4 Age and Edain plays nearly only (except Angmar) in the 50 years between the Hobbit and LotR and the War of the Ring, the "recolonization" of Arnor began in the 4 Age, the 3 Age endet (if i remember right) with the cleaning of the shire

  im against that, because: why should this stone make more damage than the normal projectile? And the flaming Stones are good against Lorien, espescially with Loriens Fortress-up

In 2.01,dwarven catas deal 300 siege damage per projectile(double projectile).Upgraded they deal 450 siege damage and 300 flame damage per projectile.The gondor trebuchets(according to books and films)never used flaming stones,but they did use parts of broken buildings.So the trebuchet no longer does any flame damage,being weaker against units,but deals more siege damage than any other ranged siege unit.Seeing everywhere flaming stones is..boring.

[Shagrat]

Nur von der Nicht-Erwähnung auf die Nicht-Existenz zu schließen, ist ein Luxus den wir uns nicht erlauben können. ^^

and Lorien has a fortress up with that no siege-machines kann attack the fortress (if they not have for exampel flaming Stones)

[Dralo]

i would prefer the non flaming projectiles,
but i dont think that the damage should be increased (i'd rather decrease the normal damage on units)

[TheMostBurning]

and Lorien has a fortress up with that no siege-machines kann attack the fortress (if they not have for exampel flaming Stones)

Lothlorien fort is only immune to siege.Who would use siege to destroy a lothlorien fort,come on

@Dralo
Upgraded trebuchets deal both siege and flame damage.Generally,buildings are weaker to siege damage,and units to fire damage.What im proposing is that if,for istance,we consider an upgraded trebuchet deals 800 siege damage and 400 flame(i don't know,however),it should deal 1200 siege damage(this is just an example).
Less fire damage=less damage against units.More siege damage=more damage against buildings.The upgrade should cost 400,it think 1400 is worth a ranged siege unit capable of dealing more damage than a basic ram.The speed should be slightly decreased,as well.

About the size,well,they could be as big as a troll stone thrower,not huge.This would justify their lack of speed.

[Dralo]

ok i understand... i forgot about the additional damage of the fire^^
but wouldn't it be enough only to remove fire damage? (and increase seige damage only a little?)  Because i think gondorian trebuchets already cause very high damage to buildings, increasing it would make them too powerfull (it isnt good for balance if one slingshot may destroy any of ones building)